January 9, 2009
Countries make diplomatic efforts to end Gaza conflict

Both Israel and Hamas rejected a call from the United Nations Security Council for an immediate cease-fire in Gaza.

The U.S. abstained from voting as it waited for the results of talks between Hamas and Israel mediated by Egypt.

Countries like France and Turkey are also involved in trying to mediate an end to the conflict.

Robert Pastor, a professor at American University and senior advisor to the Carter Center on conflict resolution in the Middle East, joins Martin Savidge to discuss diplomatic efforts by the United Nations and others to end fighting in Gaza. They discuss the rejection of the cease-fire resolution, communication with Hamas and the level of American influence in the region.

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#9

muslims support hitler apparently muslims dont acknowledge holocaust neither did hitler

#8

FOR EVERY SINGLE CHILD THAT GETS MURDERED, 10 RESISTORS WILL BE BORN
ISRAEL IS DIGGING ITS OWN GRAVES

#7

Gaza war is not. It possesses a moral clarity not only rare but excruciating.
Israel is so scrupulous about civilian life that, risking the element of surprise, it contacts enemy noncombatants in advance to warn them of approaching danger. Hamas, which started this conflict with unrelenting rocket and mortar attacks on unarmed Israelis — 6,464 launched from Gaza in the past three years — deliberately places its weapons in and near the homes of its own people.
This has two purposes. First, counting on the moral scrupulousness of Israel, Hamas figures civilian proximity might help protect at least part of its arsenal. Second, knowing that Israelis have new precision weapons that may allow them to attack nonetheless, Hamas hopes that inevitable collateral damage — or, if it is really fortunate, an errant Israeli bomb — will kill large numbers of its own people for which, of course, the world will blame Israel.
For Hamas, the only thing more prized than dead Jews are dead Palestinians. The religion of Jew-murder and self-martyrdom is ubiquitous. And deeply perverse, such as the Hamas TV children’s program in which an adorable live-action Palestinian Mickey Mouse is beaten to death by an Israeli (then replaced by his more militant cousin, Nahoul the Bee, who vows to continue on Mickey’s path to martyrdom).
At war today in Gaza, one combatant is committed to causing the most civilian pain and suffering on both sides. The other combatant is committed to saving as many lives as possible — also on both sides. It’s a recurring theme. Israel gave similar warnings to Southern Lebanese villagers before attacking Hezbollah in the Lebanon war of 2006. The Israelis did this knowing it would lose for them the element of surprise and cost the lives of their own soldiers.
That is the asymmetry of means between Hamas and Israel. But there is equal clarity regarding the asymmetry of ends. Israel has but a single objective in Gaza — peace: the calm, open, normal relations it offered Gaza when it withdrew in 2005. Doing something never done by the Turkish, British, Egyptian and Jordanian rulers of Palestine, the Israelis gave the Palestinians their first sovereign territory ever in Gaza.
What ensued? This is not ancient history. Did the Palestinians begin building the state that is supposedly their great national aim? No. No roads, no industry, no courts, no civil society at all. The flourishing greenhouses that Israel left behind for the Palestinians were destroyed and abandoned. Instead, Gaza’s Iranian-sponsored rulers have devoted all their resources to turning it into a terror base — importing weapons, training terrorists, building tunnels with which to kidnap Israelis on the other side. And of course firing rockets unceasingly.
The grievance? It cannot be occupation, military control or settlers. They were all removed in September 2005. There’s only one grievance and Hamas is open about it. Israel’s very existence.
Nor does Hamas conceal its strategy. Provoke conflict. Wait for the inevitable civilian casualties. Bring down the world’s opprobrium on Israel. Force it into an untenable cease-fire — exactly as happened in Lebanon. Then, as in Lebanon, rearm, rebuild and mobilize for the next round. Perpetual war. Since its raison d’etre is the eradication of Israel, there are only two possible outcomes: the defeat of Hamas or the extinction of Israel.
Israel’s only response is to try to do what it failed to do after the Gaza withdrawal. The unpardonable strategic error of its architect, Ariel Sharon, was not the withdrawal itself but the failure to immediately establish a deterrence regime under which no violence would be tolerated after the removal of any and all Israeli presence — the ostensible justification for previous Palestinian attacks. Instead, Israel allowed unceasing rocket fire, implicitly acquiescing to a state of active war and indiscriminate terror.
Hamas’s rejection of an extension of its often-violated six-month cease-fire (during which the rockets never stopped, just were less frequent) gave Israel a rare opportunity to establish the norm it should have insisted upon three years ago: no rockets, no mortar fire, no kidnapping, no acts of war. As the U.S. government has officially stated: a sustainable and enduring cease-fire. If this fighting ends with anything less than that, Israel will have lost yet another war. The question is whether Israel still retains the nerve — and the moral self-assurance — to win.
The Moral Clarity | 01.06.09 - 9:09 am | #
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#6

Doron: I think peace will come to region, when you and many Israelis like you acknowledge that the (OCUPPATION STUPIED), only when the occupation ends, so will end all the misery in the Middle East. Any distraction from that will give hate preachers like you an excuse to continue to repeat empty phrases: the Palestinians teach their children hate and that is why we have a conflict in the Middle East. Give me one Jewish family teaching its kids kind words about Nazism and Hitler. The Palestinians can not teach their children fiction. They must teach them facts and facts are stubborn in this case. Since 1948 until now European Jews are ethnically cleansing Palestinians. They are forcing them out of their homes, villages, farms and schools and replacing them with Russian and other Jews. In the last 20 years Israel absorbed more than a million and half Jew from the outside. The million and half replaced Palestinians in the West Bank, Jerusalem, and other Palestinian/Arab neighborhoods inside Israel, the ROUTE of the WALL speaks volumes to this. Thousands of acres are being confiscated from Palestinians under the cover of security, where in reality it is made to steal more land from the Palestinians. Every nation on earth has the right to secure its boarders including Israel. But no nation on earth can steal land from others under the cover of security. Israel should have built its wall on its internationally recognized boundaries (The Green Line). The US is talking about building a wall between Mexico and its southern boarders to prevent illegal immigration. Can the US build that wall on Mexican territory or it must be on American territory. I think if you answer that question sincerely you will know why Palestinian children will continue to resist your dominance over them for ever. Palestinian children are seeing that and asking many questions about it, their parents can not lie, the way Jewish mothers are teaching their children about the Holocaust.
It is unfortunate that the Palestinians are paying heavily for Western Pogroms, and the Holocaust. Doron, as for the show, this is the first time ever that an Israeli viewpoint was not aired. Just look at the days before, where many of us who watch the show began thinking that Siedorot is a New York Suburb, and the way Martin Savidge presents the issue. All the sudden Martin cars about Siedorot more than the Israelis.

#5

Dear The World,
Friday’s program (9 January) contained interviews with Robert Pastor of the Carter Center/ American University, Dr. Nabil Abuznaid, Fatah’s chief in Washington, and Robert Hoge, an editor of “Foreign Affairs”.

All of the coverage slanted against Israel. Pastor and Hoge asserted that the US was not doing enough about Gaza, and the latter urged engagement with Syria and Iran. Dr. Abuznaid did the usual thing of blaming all on Israel, and refusing even to assign much blame to Hamas.

And, at the end of the program, we were subjected to a piece about Tehran, portraying the positive human side, and ignoring Iran’s ugly side. So, nastiness about Israel, and a puff piece for Iran.

I wonder when the World will expose the level of cynicism displayed by Abbas, Egypt, etc., and go beyond punting Arab views and its all Israel’s fault?

Fatah has shown a history of not caring about civilians that is second only to Hamas. When scores of Fatah fighters fled Gaza after Hamas took over Gaza, Israel let them in. Abbas did not allow them into Jericho and deported them back to Gaza. Some of them may well have been amongst the 35 “collaborators” reportedly executed by Hamas during the current fighting.

As for Egypt - it still refuses to open Rafah, and still most of the food and other supplies to Gaza is passing through Israel. Egypt never cared about individual Gazans when it ran Gaza (from 1948 to 1967) and doesn’t care now. It sees Gaza as a useful thorn in Israel’s side to constantly trouble and threaten Israel.

Finally, as regards Robert Hoge’s call for more US engagement on Arab-Israeli peace. He suggested a new approach, legitimizing Iran and Syria, and perhaps even Hamas. Thus all the pressure will be placed on Israel. This ignores the fact that every Israeli concession in recent years has led only to more attacks and more extremism.

It also ignores President Clinton’s experience - from which President Barack Obama should learn. Clinton lavished attention on Arafat, squeezed major concessions out of Israel - and Arafat responded with war. Abbas cultivates an image of moderation, but his positions on every basic issue are the same as Arafat’s.

No amount of involvement by the US, or UN, or EU, or man on the moon, will bring peace when at heart, it is the mere existence of Israel, in any form, that the Arab world sees as a humiliation. How long will it take to see this? How long will it take to tell that peace can come only when the Arab world stops teaching hate, and endless war against Israel?

#4

Marcel,

If you learn from history Muslims are the one who always protected the Jews. They did not kill the jews like Hitler did.
Muslims and Jewa lived peacefully in Palestine before creation of Israel. Also, thanks for stating the fact that you need more land as original Israel was too small to live. Therefore, you don’t care abut the original inhabitants, it is fine to drive them out of their land and call them terrorist.

#3

Why does everyone ignore the article by David Rose, in the April 2008 issue of Vanity Fair, which shows how members of the Bush administration promoted a bloody civil war between Fatah and Hamas in Gaza?

#2

Marcel: you are an ill informed human that knows very little and insists on entering a club of intellectuals and learned men and women. You say that the UN is very bad when it comes to Israel. I have a question to you, who created Israel. Had not been for the UN, Israel would have never been established. But, of course when the UN speaks of Israeli human rights abuses and war crimes, it becomes a very bad organization, but when it divides Palestine to two states, and as a result the majority of the Palestinians are ethnically cleansed at the hands of Israel and forced out of their homes to live in refugee camps, you liked what it did. Your logic is similar to that of George Bush’s. The US president would like to see freedom all over the world, when it comes to the Palestinians, he, international law, American Official Foreign Policy, all his promises to the Palestinians, are not worthy. The West’s logic when it comes to the Palestinians is skewed. Killing civilians anywhere on earth according to Western officials is worthy of investigations and indictments, but if Israel is the killer the media and government officials will resort to a clash: Israel has the right to defend itself. Defend against who? Against an occupied population, which by law its safety and security is the responsibility of the occupier. Gaza is still occupied, the Palestinians can not do anything or go anywhere without Israeli permission. When will the west rise to its moral conscious and stop blaming the victims all the time.

#1

The U.N. has proven to be incompetent when it comes to any diplomatic solutions,in fact the U.N always makes things worse than they were before when it comes to Israel.
We see this with Hizbollah in Lebanon NOW A GREATER THREAT THAN BEFORE THE WAR IN 2006.
The only solution the U.N provides is a temporary break before the big war which Iran,Syria,Hizbollah have prepared for in order to wipe out Israel.
It’s so sad that the Arab/Islamic world is so greedy and intolerant that they will not allow non-Moslems to live in peace on a tiny sliver of land about the size of New Jersey.
The problem is Islam and it’s hate and intolerance and the Wests’ appeasment of this hate filled religion.
New Jersey is the 5th-smallest US state, covering about 7800 square miles or 20,000 square kilometers. iris.org.il
As the comparison map above shows, the land currently controlled by the State of Israel (including disputed territories) is not much larger. Israel in its pre-1967 borders was 8,019 square miles or 20,770 square kilometers, just barely bigger than New Jersey.

Considering the its size, is Israel large enough that it can afford give away land to try to placate the Arabs?

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